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	<title>Comments on: &lt;3 Grace Wang</title>
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	<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/</link>
	<description>by Ryan McLaughlin ~ The Humanaught</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 15 Mar 2010 19:28:32 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Human flesh search engines&#8211;crowd-sourcing &#34;justice&#34; &#124; A China Blog on Suzhou Expat Life</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-27411</link>
		<dc:creator>Human flesh search engines&#8211;crowd-sourcing &#34;justice&#34; &#124; A China Blog on Suzhou Expat Life</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 04:06:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-27411</guid>
		<description>[...] Be sure to read Grace Wang&#8217;s editorial in the Washington Post for her version of things. My thoughts on this, as posted at the time, can be read here. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Be sure to read Grace Wang&#8217;s editorial in the Washington Post for her version of things. My thoughts on this, as posted at the time, can be read here. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: totalrecall</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25158</link>
		<dc:creator>totalrecall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 May 2008 03:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25158</guid>
		<description>i just bumped into this zhangxispace.spaces when i did a google search...

true or not, good or evil...  or does it matter!?

http://zhangxispace.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!87046622FD790F8E!762.entry</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i just bumped into this zhangxispace.spaces when i did a google search&#8230;</p>
<p>true or not, good or evil&#8230;  or does it matter!?</p>
<p><a href="http://zhangxispace.spaces.live.com/blog/cns" rel="nofollow">http://zhangxispace.spaces.live.com/blog/cns</a>!87046622FD790F8E!762.entry</p>
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		<title>By: Bo</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25122</link>
		<dc:creator>Bo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 01:15:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25122</guid>
		<description>Obviously, the attacks on her parents are to be condemned but Grace&#039;s actions are naive at best, and cynical at worst.

Think about it, she wrote &quot;FREE TIBET&quot; on the back on the Tibetan crowd locked in a counter-demonstration against the Chinese crowd.  

She explains this by saying that she only agreed to write it so that the Tibetan side will come to the negotiating table, this is extraordinarily silly.

If we flipped the situation around and the Chinese crowd got a Tibetan supporter who wanted to mediate to write &quot;ONE CHINA&quot; on the backs of one of the Pro-China Demonstrators as a precondition for negotiation, it would be the same situation but reversed.

Mediators must never assert themselves as anything but neutral, or even allow themselves to be perceived as non-neutral.  By writing &quot;FREE TIBET&quot; on the back of the Tibetan Supporter, she effectively killed off any chance of her mediating.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obviously, the attacks on her parents are to be condemned but Grace&#8217;s actions are naive at best, and cynical at worst.</p>
<p>Think about it, she wrote &#8220;FREE TIBET&#8221; on the back on the Tibetan crowd locked in a counter-demonstration against the Chinese crowd.  </p>
<p>She explains this by saying that she only agreed to write it so that the Tibetan side will come to the negotiating table, this is extraordinarily silly.</p>
<p>If we flipped the situation around and the Chinese crowd got a Tibetan supporter who wanted to mediate to write &#8220;ONE CHINA&#8221; on the backs of one of the Pro-China Demonstrators as a precondition for negotiation, it would be the same situation but reversed.</p>
<p>Mediators must never assert themselves as anything but neutral, or even allow themselves to be perceived as non-neutral.  By writing &#8220;FREE TIBET&#8221; on the back of the Tibetan Supporter, she effectively killed off any chance of her mediating.</p>
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		<title>By: ABC</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25121</link>
		<dc:creator>ABC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 00:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25121</guid>
		<description>We know that the concept of a nation was forcibly brought into China during Qing dynasty.  The founding father of Modern China Sun Zhongshan adopted the concept of nationality and grouped all different peoples under the name “Chinese” regardless how diversified those peoples are.  The concept of westernized Nationalism is strength for national unity but it is also the root of many conflicts in this World.  

Ever since the big migration of the ancestors of Mongoloid Asians arrived in Southeast Asia at about 10,000 years ago, the place we called “Zhong Hua” has been a giant melting pot for mongoloids like Chu, Qi, Wu, Yue, Eastern Yi, Manchurians, Huns, Turks, Mongols, and Tibetans.  Most people in Northern China are genetically closer to Tibetan people than their counterparts in Southern China.  It is fair to say Zhong Hua people are as heterogeneous as people in Europe.

With such understanding, we can say that the Tibetan problem is really politicized by all sides: Westerners, Dalai Lama clique, and Chinese government.  We should put politics aside and let the melting pot of Zhong Hua take its natural course.  Future of the History is dynamic.  The concept of “nationalism” (and “independence”) goes against the flow of History.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We know that the concept of a nation was forcibly brought into China during Qing dynasty.  The founding father of Modern China Sun Zhongshan adopted the concept of nationality and grouped all different peoples under the name “Chinese” regardless how diversified those peoples are.  The concept of westernized Nationalism is strength for national unity but it is also the root of many conflicts in this World.  </p>
<p>Ever since the big migration of the ancestors of Mongoloid Asians arrived in Southeast Asia at about 10,000 years ago, the place we called “Zhong Hua” has been a giant melting pot for mongoloids like Chu, Qi, Wu, Yue, Eastern Yi, Manchurians, Huns, Turks, Mongols, and Tibetans.  Most people in Northern China are genetically closer to Tibetan people than their counterparts in Southern China.  It is fair to say Zhong Hua people are as heterogeneous as people in Europe.</p>
<p>With such understanding, we can say that the Tibetan problem is really politicized by all sides: Westerners, Dalai Lama clique, and Chinese government.  We should put politics aside and let the melting pot of Zhong Hua take its natural course.  Future of the History is dynamic.  The concept of “nationalism” (and “independence”) goes against the flow of History.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25116</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 04:16:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25116</guid>
		<description>@Little Alex: However, this isn&#039;t China going to far-off continents and attempting to bring civilization to the &quot;savages&quot; through imperialism.

The ruling of the Steppe has continuously changed hands for over a thousand years. Nomads to Chinese, Chinese to Mongols, Mongols to Tibetans, Tibetans to Mongols, Mongols to Manchus, Manchus to Han... it&#039;s not quite as simple or clear cut as a uni student at a sit-in might hope.

And aside from historical rights being called into question, the biggest factor in it all is who is in charge now.

That tends to hold sway the world over.

Israel isn&#039;t giving up the West Bank, never mind the rest of &quot;Palestine&quot;. Canada&#039;s in no rush to have Quebec be its own nation (referendums a plenty or not). And last I heard California, Texas, Arizona and New Mexico aren&#039;t clamoring to help create the great nation of Aztlán.

All places that have been annexed to their current ruling nations in much more recent history than Tibet.

I&#039;m not saying it&#039;s right. Who gets to draw the lines on maps is not for me to say. I&#039;m just saying it&#039;s often left out of the discussion.

I also think that not a great deal of thought is put into what would happen to the country if it did get independence.

Nor are we really dealing with the opinions of your every day Tibetans. But rather a group of people (and their supporters) who lost all their power when the CPC strengthened their grip on the far-off region in the late 50s.

Again, not choosing sides here, simply pointing out that there are more sides to all this than just pro/anti indep. Tibet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Little Alex: However, this isn&#8217;t China going to far-off continents and attempting to bring civilization to the &#8220;savages&#8221; through imperialism.</p>
<p>The ruling of the Steppe has continuously changed hands for over a thousand years. Nomads to Chinese, Chinese to Mongols, Mongols to Tibetans, Tibetans to Mongols, Mongols to Manchus, Manchus to Han&#8230; it&#8217;s not quite as simple or clear cut as a uni student at a sit-in might hope.</p>
<p>And aside from historical rights being called into question, the biggest factor in it all is who is in charge now.</p>
<p>That tends to hold sway the world over.</p>
<p>Israel isn&#8217;t giving up the West Bank, never mind the rest of &#8220;Palestine&#8221;. Canada&#8217;s in no rush to have Quebec be its own nation (referendums a plenty or not). And last I heard California, Texas, Arizona and New Mexico aren&#8217;t clamoring to help create the great nation of Aztlán.</p>
<p>All places that have been annexed to their current ruling nations in much more recent history than Tibet.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying it&#8217;s right. Who gets to draw the lines on maps is not for me to say. I&#8217;m just saying it&#8217;s often left out of the discussion.</p>
<p>I also think that not a great deal of thought is put into what would happen to the country if it did get independence.</p>
<p>Nor are we really dealing with the opinions of your every day Tibetans. But rather a group of people (and their supporters) who lost all their power when the CPC strengthened their grip on the far-off region in the late 50s.</p>
<p>Again, not choosing sides here, simply pointing out that there are more sides to all this than just pro/anti indep. Tibet.</p>
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		<title>By: little Alex</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25115</link>
		<dc:creator>little Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 03:33:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25115</guid>
		<description>Um, I screwed up on the last comment, so here is one of the posts that&#039;s being passed around in mainland BBS that might or might not shed more light on the intentions of Grace Wang.
http://www.mobilejoy.com.cn/thread-9855-1-1.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Um, I screwed up on the last comment, so here is one of the posts that&#8217;s being passed around in mainland BBS that might or might not shed more light on the intentions of Grace Wang.<br />
<a href="http://www.mobilejoy.com.cn/thread-9855-1-1.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.mobilejoy.com.cn/thread-9855-1-1.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: little Alex</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25114</link>
		<dc:creator>little Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 03:25:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25114</guid>
		<description>@Ryan

Well, the general mainland Chinese view on Tibet is awfully similar to that of &#039;the white men&#039;s burden&#039; back in the days... I&#039;m not sure we have the right to just go in and so-called &#039;civilise&#039; them...

As to Grace Wang, I mean, just looking at the clip on youtube is pretty telling. She jumped into the fray when the two grShe&#039;s started off speaking English, which already says a lot about who her intended audience is (she couldn&#039;t have failed to notice all the cameras, etc. around her). 

Nonetheless, of course that doesn&#039;t excuse the total invasion of her and her family&#039;s privacy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ryan</p>
<p>Well, the general mainland Chinese view on Tibet is awfully similar to that of &#8216;the white men&#8217;s burden&#8217; back in the days&#8230; I&#8217;m not sure we have the right to just go in and so-called &#8216;civilise&#8217; them&#8230;</p>
<p>As to Grace Wang, I mean, just looking at the clip on youtube is pretty telling. She jumped into the fray when the two grShe&#8217;s started off speaking English, which already says a lot about who her intended audience is (she couldn&#8217;t have failed to notice all the cameras, etc. around her). </p>
<p>Nonetheless, of course that doesn&#8217;t excuse the total invasion of her and her family&#8217;s privacy.</p>
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		<title>By: Dale Andersen</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25104</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale Andersen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:28:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25104</guid>
		<description>&lt;img src=&quot;http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3188/2439382231_d67e3070da_o.jpg&quot; alt=&quot;&quot; width=&quot;300&quot; /&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3188/2439382231_d67e3070da_o.jpg" alt="" width="300" /></p>
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		<title>By: Ryan</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25102</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 00:39:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25102</guid>
		<description>@Dale: I don&#039;t disagree.

One of the biggest thing that Westerners in the FT protest circles tend to ignore is that no matter the debate, life for your average Tibetan, as it has for your average Chinese, has improved by leaps and bounds in the last 10-20 years.

For an indigenous culture stuck atop a high-altitude plain devoid of water and much in the way of usable resources - that&#039;s a feat. And in no small part due to economic incentives put into place (as a matter of control or not) by the CPC government.

However, my feelings are that we can&#039;t say who &quot;deserves&quot; independence and/or whether that independence would be a benefit to them. It&#039;s just no one&#039;s call but the people fighting for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dale: I don&#8217;t disagree.</p>
<p>One of the biggest thing that Westerners in the FT protest circles tend to ignore is that no matter the debate, life for your average Tibetan, as it has for your average Chinese, has improved by leaps and bounds in the last 10-20 years.</p>
<p>For an indigenous culture stuck atop a high-altitude plain devoid of water and much in the way of usable resources &#8211; that&#8217;s a feat. And in no small part due to economic incentives put into place (as a matter of control or not) by the CPC government.</p>
<p>However, my feelings are that we can&#8217;t say who &#8220;deserves&#8221; independence and/or whether that independence would be a benefit to them. It&#8217;s just no one&#8217;s call but the people fighting for it.</p>
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		<title>By: dale andersen</title>
		<link>http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/general/heart-grace-wang/#comment-25101</link>
		<dc:creator>dale andersen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 20:59:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thehumanaught.com/blog/?p=750#comment-25101</guid>
		<description>What has Tibet ever done for anyone?  Answer: nothing.

For most Americans, if Richard Gere had decided to be a plumber or a carpenter, no one would ever have heard of Tibet...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What has Tibet ever done for anyone?  Answer: nothing.</p>
<p>For most Americans, if Richard Gere had decided to be a plumber or a carpenter, no one would ever have heard of Tibet&#8230;</p>
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